Investing $100 Million to Create Africa's Next Million Jobs: Why Manufacturing Beats Tech with Daniel Yu

[00:00:00] You're listening to the Unlocking Africa Podcast. I got inspired to start building out digital solutions for small businesses, which eventually led to the company that I founded and grew for over a decade. When you look at the manufacturing policies and incentives that are put in place in various African economies, they tend to be very focused on import substitution, which is a very attractive sounding idea. But once again, the

[00:00:25] evidence really does not show that it leads to the positive transformative results. For every dollar of capital that the African Jobs Fund is spending, we want to see at least $200 in African worker lifetime earnings increase. Stay tuned as we bring you inspiring people who are unlocking Africa's economic potential. You're listening to the Unlocking Africa Podcast with your host, Terser Adamu.

[00:00:55] Welcome to another episode of the Unlocking Africa Podcast, where we explore the ideas, innovations and strategies unlocking Africa's economic potential. For more than a decade, Africa's growth story has largely been told through the lens of technology. We've celebrated unicorns, fintech, e-commerce, venture capital and digital innovation. And while those businesses have transformed

[00:01:21] millions of lives, one uncomfortable reality remains, Africa is still not creating enough productive jobs at scale. Every year, millions of young Africans enter the labour market, yet formal employment continues to lag behind population growth. Meanwhile, countries across Europe, Asia and North America are facing aging populations, labour shortages and growing pressure to diversify global manufacturing supply chains.

[00:01:51] What if those two challenges could actually solve each other? My guest today believes they can. Daniel Yu is a founder of the Africa Jobs Fund, a new philanthropic venture builder aimed to mobilise $100 million over the next five years to back African manufacturing companies and workforce infrastructure capable of creating millions of higher productivity jobs across Africa.

[00:02:19] Daniel Yu is a founder of the Africa Jobs Fund, a new philanthropic venture builder aiming to mobilise $100 million over the next five years to back African manufacturing companies and workforce infrastructure capable of creating millions of higher productivity jobs across Africa. Daniel, welcome, welcome, welcome back to the Unlocking Africa podcast. How are you?

[00:02:48] Thank you, thank you. It's a pleasure to be here again. I'm doing great. Fantastic. As I said, welcome back. You're one of very few people who have come back the second time, but you've come back with a corker, a very interesting, exciting initiative, very different to what we were speaking about before. So for anyone who is not familiar with yourself and maybe missed the first time around, can you give us a introduction into who Daniel Yu is?

[00:03:16] Absolutely. I am originally a software developer by background, grew up in California, but was always very internationally oriented and had the chance to travel and live across a variety of places, businesses, including when I was in university and exchange program in Egypt. And while I was there, I got inspired to start building out digital solutions for small businesses, which eventually led to the

[00:03:41] company that I founded and grew for over a decade, which is Wosoko. And that became one of Africa's largest e-commerce companies and ultimately completed a merger in 2024 with e-commerce company Maxab, following which I stepped back from management last year in order to focus on the next chapter, which is the Africa Jobs Fund. And it's a chapter that is very close to my heart and resonates with myself. It's something

[00:04:09] I've been talking about for many years and sometimes it falls on deaf ears in terms of the way for Africa to economically grow at scale is to create jobs at scale. And manufacturing and industrialization seems to be the most sensible and feasible routes. But anyway, we'll get into that conversation. I know that last time we had a conversation on the podcast, it was more about

[00:04:34] technology, commerce, Wosoko. Today we're talking about manufacturing, labor markets and industrial policy. So during that period or the gap since we last spoke, what fundamentally changed in your thinking? Yes. So I would say, you know, the 11 years that I spent building out Wosoko was extremely educational and extremely fulfilling and rewarding. You know, scaling up a company to over

[00:05:02] 2000 workers, you know, completing Africa's largest tech merger. And really, you know, as an e-commerce company, seeing all the different aspects of an industrial ecosystem, you know, working on the one side with huge companies, you know, Unilever, Procter & Gamble, lots of the biggest regional manufacturers as well. And then on the other hand, working with these, you know, tiny mom and pop businesses and kind of seeing everything in between. And I think what I ultimately

[00:05:31] realized is that the biggest constraints to unlocking Africa's economic potential, it's not just going to be technology or technology enabled businesses. You know, I think there's a lot of attention, there's a lot of resources that have been put into, you know, all the latest, you know, fintech apps or, you know, how Web3 is going to come in and transform everything. Or even now with

[00:05:57] with AI, you know, talking about how, you know, this is this is going to be the thing that that unlocks, you know, Africa's economic growth potential. But, you know, the more that I've kind of stepped back and, you know, also, you know, been a part of deploying, you know, technology through the course of Wosoko, the more that I realized it's actually, it's the boring stuff. It's the nuts and bolts of how to actually deliver goods and services to the biggest markets possible.

[00:06:24] And, you know, fundamentally, actually, how do we actually integrate these economies in Africa with the global economy? Because that's fundamentally where wealth and economic growth comes from. You don't create a vibrant, competitive, rich economy by just doing stuff on your own. You create that growth and that wealth by exchanging and leveling up so that you're as good as everyone else globally, and that

[00:06:53] you have things that you can you can sell and you can produce that other people around the world what to buy from you. And I think that kind of focus is ultimately something that's been a bit lost, you know, in in a lot of the headlines and the the the the business stories that tend to get emphasized. And so that's really, you know, for me with Africa jobs fund, what I'm hoping to bring a little bit more focus and emphasis on and hopefully deploy resources that can

[00:07:23] bring these, you know, boring businesses more to the foreground and get the best talent working on solving these fundamental challenges and unlocking these opportunities, you know, for the benefit of the entire continent. So was it a eureka moment where you realized that maybe technology alone wasn't going to create this or unlock the economic potential on the continent or create jobs at scale that Africa needs?

[00:07:50] I would say it's really just looking at the data and also looking at the history. So, you know, if you go into the evidence and you actually look at what has shifted hundreds of millions of people out of subsistence poverty and into, you know, working class stable and, you know, over the generations, you know, prosperous middle class livelihoods, it is industrialization, it is manufacturing,

[00:08:18] manufacturing, and I would say specifically export manufacturing. You know, if you look at, obviously, the most recent cases of the, you know, astonishing growth and transformation of not just China, but even other countries in Asia, Vietnam, now even Bangladesh, you know, they have rapidly industrialized and created hundreds of millions of better lives and stable incomes and careers, you know, through export manufacturing

[00:08:43] manufacturing as their growth pathway. But even you, you go back further, you can go all the way back to the, the, the original industrial revolution in England in the 1700s. And you look at what they did to move people out of being subsistence farmers and into productive working class, you know, stable income members of society. And that was also through export manufacturing, you know, making textiles in the mills and, and, you know, exporting the linens, um, uh, you know, overseas to buyers. And so, you know,

[00:09:09] the fundamental formula has not changed here for, for, for hundreds of years. And so to me, it's just bizarre that somehow this is not the number one focus for economic development and strategy across the board. And so I think it's about kind of saying, Hey, um, let, let's do what we already know works. We have the evidence, we have the data for hundreds of years now on what needs to be done and let's get after it. Um, so I think, I think that for me was really the driving momentum and realization behind, you know,

[00:09:39] why we need, uh, you know, something like the Africa jobs fund. This is great news to me because it's a conversation I have so many times in terms of no country or economy has economically developed without embracing manufacturing or mass industrialization. And as someone who is a international trade professional, I'm very interested learning your thoughts in terms of manufacturing and export manufacturing.

[00:10:04] And we are seeing renewed interest in industrial policy and manufacturing globally. But why do you believe export manufacturing remains one of the fastest and most reliable routes out of poverty? I think there are a few key reasons why export manufacturing in particular is the way to go. So, um, and, and I would draw the distinction here between manufacturing generally, um, because I, I think a lot of times,

[00:10:34] when you look at the manufacturing policies and incentives that are put in place, um, in, in, in various African economies, they tend to be very focused on manufacturing generally, or even on import substitution. Um, which is a, I think very attractive sounding idea, but once again, the evidence really does not show that it leads to the, the positive transformative results, um, that, that people hope for.

[00:10:57] So this idea that, oh, um, we are importing an item, you know, let's say, uh, shoes and, uh, you know, we shouldn't be importing shoes. We can make our own shoes. Like let's just make shoes. And, uh, you know, let's give, uh, let's put up high tariffs. Let's give incentives to local manufacturers. Now make shoes. Um, as I said, it sounds attractive. Um, but ultimately you have to ask the question of, you know, is the country in a place where they, in the long run, can competitively make shoes, um, at a,

[00:11:27] a, a globally, um, uh, competitive level. And if the country ultimately cannot, then it's actually a bad idea to waste money, subsidizing an inefficient industry, making shoes locally. Maybe it is better, um, you know, to have, uh, the shoes made in a different country where they are much better at making the shoes. And then you can concentrate your manufacturing on something that you can truly do at a world-class level to then sell to them. You know, that, that's the fundamental of, of, of what, you know, trade specialization actually means.

[00:11:57] You focus on what you're good at doing and I'll focus on what I'm good at doing. And together by trading, we'll have more surplus. We'll have more together than we would if we were both trying to make everything ourselves. Um, and so I think the, the focus on export manufacturing is really about, um, being selective and being strategic on what are the industries? What are the things that we actually can do at a world-class level?

[00:12:22] Let's focus on those by producing those items and selling it globally. We're not restricted by the limited purchasing power of our lower income economy that we have domestically. And so you can kind of break out of that, that purchasing power trap. Um, and then the other thing that I think is very key here is when you're selling and you're building up an industry to sell globally, um, and you have many players in that industry, it's much more of a positive sum collaborative environment as well, because

[00:12:52] you're going after the whole global ocean of, of, of market demand for what you're doing as opposed to fighting with each other over the scraps of this small market that you have locally. And I think that's oftentimes what you see in these business and manufacturing environments that are focused very domestically, which is, um, the domestic incumbent who often has a monopoly or a near monopoly position.

[00:13:14] They are extremely threatened if someone else comes in to try to sell and manufacture for the local market. Um, but you know, if, if we're selling our shoes globally and you know, I'm making shoes to export, you're also making shoes to export almost definitely.

[00:13:28] We're not selling to the same buyer because there's so many consumers and buyers of, of shoes globally, but we can really, really benefit by supporting each other and kind of saying, Hey, we're both facing these challenges. Let's go to the government together to try to figure out how we unblock this. You know, we need more suppliers for, you know, the shoelaces. Great. Let's, uh, you know, co-invest, uh, you know, set up, uh, um, an input supplier locally who can help, you know, solve that gap in the market. Um, the dynamics around all of this in terms of your, your ability to kind of sell,

[00:13:58] to a much bigger base as well as building more of these positive, some collaborative ecosystem relationships is much, much higher when you're looking at the export manufacturing angle. You touched on something important, which was about becoming selective and strategic about which approach to take, which I guess is a strategy which was adopted in East Asia and lifted hundreds of millions of people out of poverty through manufacturing led growth.

[00:14:24] So if we take that as an example, which part of that story do you think Africa can realistically replicate? I think there are increasing opportunities for Africa to actually learn from the lessons of Asia and apply them into their own industrialization approaches today.

[00:14:44] So, you know, historically, um, Africa was at a disadvantage, um, especially in terms of, of infrastructure and labor costs, um, which I think are reflections of the same kind of core challenge of not having the same kinds of population density and, and therefore, you know, market access, um, at, uh, competitive rates that, um, a lot of the, the higher population density Asian markets had.

[00:15:07] Um, that being said, you know, because the Asian markets, um, have, you know, largely industrialized and are really kind of moving up, um, the, the, the income curve, the labor costs, uh, increasingly in, um, many African countries are, uh, competitive. And we have seen, you know, enough infrastructure improvements where I think, um, you know, certain markets, um, can be competitive, um, in producing certain types of goods.

[00:15:34] Um, and so, you know, the, the, the, the chessboard here is, it's constantly changing. And I think it's, it's also, you know, a question of kind of looking a few moves ahead and recognizing, okay, where do we have the, the ingredients now to be competitive? Um, and, you know, can we make a strategic, um, concerted effort and the right kinds of investments, um, to unlock our standing and participation in that global industry?

[00:15:59] Um, and so I think, um, similarly to, you know, for example, you know, the Bangladesh garment industry where they very successfully, uh, tapped into the South Korean garment industry, which was basically getting priced out of the global markets as South Korea, uh, developed and, and, and the wages really increased. And they, they managed to kind of bring the South Koreans over to help seed and set up, um, their initial garment industry, uh, in Bangladesh.

[00:16:25] I think it's a similar opportunity now to look at who are the global exporters, the producers who already have the buyer, uh, demand side relationships and help them to set up new production in African countries. Um, and, you know, look at what are the barriers? What are the requirements that need to be met in order for that African production to be competitive with their other sourcing right now?

[00:16:51] So I think the question for me is in terms of the work you've been doing on the continent over the last decade or so, why do you believe Africa is better positioned today to completing global manufacturing?

[00:17:06] I think, as mentioned, a lot of the dynamics, you know, especially just Asia itself having, you know, uh, rapidly developed and industrialized and, and rising labor costs there, you know, mean that, uh, Africa by virtue of, of, of, uh, not having seen as fast economic growth and takeoff in that period, you know, is, is now in a position to be competitive in some of these more entry-level manufacturing industries.

[00:17:32] Um, I think, I think, I think the other opportunity is, as I said, you know, the, the infrastructure, you know, has improved. We're seeing, um, you know, big projects in various countries that are, uh, reducing the electricity costs, you know, Ethiopia, Tanzania, uh, both have, you know, very transformative, uh, dams that have dramatically increased, um, their, their electricity availability.

[00:17:53] Um, and so, you know, there are a lot of indicators that in, in certain places, things are moving in the right direction to be more competitive as a, a global, uh, economic, um, player. And I think it's, but you, you still have to seize on those ingredients, um, to, to, to, to, to, to bring them together and, and start actually cooking up, uh, your, your, your industrial, uh, sectors.

[00:18:20] And I think that's where having strategic focus, engaging with existing successful players in the global export industry, bringing them into the market, um, ensuring that the, the conditions are as streamlined as possible. You know, it takes this, um, this kind of proactive engagement and want to make it happen. And I think, you know, one of the benefits that we have is Africa jobs fund is our ability to actually play a direct role in making that happen.

[00:18:50] So I think rather than, um, you know, waiting for governments, um, to, uh, you know, figure out and map out all these opportunities where, you know, uh, for better or worse, you know, governments are often, um, you know, quite capacity constrained to do this kind of agile. And, and, and entrepreneurial work, I think Africa jobs fund can, you know, compliment some of the, the, the national strategies that we're seeing, um, African governments increasingly put forward.

[00:19:15] Um, but, you know, get more directly involved ourselves in, for example, uh, engaging with, uh, Asian manufacturers and figuring out how we can help them expand their production, uh, to Africa, looking at doing joint venture investments, uh, to help de-risk and capital share some of those, those projects as well. These are all things that, that we're really excited to do as an independent, you know, private player who cares about, you know, trying to unlock more of this activity at the ecosystem level.

[00:19:43] Fantastic. So as you mentioned, with wages rising across parts of Asia and companies diversifying supply chains, do you think we're actually witnessing maybe a once in a generation opportunity for African economies?

[00:19:57] I think this is a unique window of opportunity. Um, and it, it is one that I think must be seized. So if we look at what's happening right now with manufacturing globally, it is still highly dependent on entry-level manual lower-skilled labor in order to, to, to, to produce the, the essential goods, um, that, that, that the global economy demands.

[00:20:19] I do think that we will see increasing automation in, uh, manufacturing processes over time. Um, right now, I think that automation focus is largely on the, the higher end, uh, the most advanced manufacturing, because that's, um, where the most expensive production is currently happening.

[00:20:37] Things like cars and microchips. Um, but over time as industrial robots and new capabilities come online, I expect that to start to filter down into the, um, less advanced manufacturing too. And so I think there is a risk if governments, um, and, and, and countries wait too long, uh, to industrialize where in some sense you could see, um, fully automated manufacturing takeover for,

[00:21:07] um, very broad parts of, um, of, of, of the industrial economy. And what you don't want to do is, is, is, is miss the window that exists today where African markets, um, are competitive or have the ingredients, uh, to, to step into global manufacturing value chains. Um, but if you wait 20 years, um, maybe, um, those opportunities won't exist anymore because the automotive technologies will be advanced enough and, and, and,

[00:21:37] and cheap enough, um, that, uh, the need to set up new production facilities in areas, um, that are, that require a lot of human workers, um, at competitive rates, that, that will no longer, um, be the, the, the, the, the need or focus because, um, the, the, the automated, uh, technologies are, are good enough at that point. I know that manufacturing is only one side of the Africa job fund thesis.

[00:22:03] The other is something that remains, I guess, controversial, which is international labor mobility. When people hear that they immediately think brain drain, but you argue almost the opposite. Why is that? Once again, I'm a data driven guy. So, so I, I want to look at the evidence. I want to see, you know, what the numbers actually say. And, you know, the, the, the brain drain area, I think is something that, you know, sounds seducingly attractive and, and logical.

[00:22:32] Um, you know, you have, uh, people leaving a country to go work in a different country. That must mean that this is a net loss, uh, for the origin country. But once again, if you look at the data, um, this is, this is very, very much not the case. Um, and I think there's, there's a few, you know, key reasons for, for why this is. So one talent and brain capacity, um, is not a static quantity.

[00:22:55] So, you know, brains very much develop and skills and talent develops by having access and exposure, uh, to new environments and more competitive, higher skilled opportunities. Um, and so someone who, um, you know, graduates, uh, from, uh, high school in a country, but has the opportunity to go to one of the world's top universities or go to, uh, uh, get a,

[00:23:18] a top job opportunity in a, um, in a high income, uh, economy is going to develop their skills and their capabilities in ways that, um, might not be available to them if they had stayed in their origin country. Um, and so it's this exposure to the global economy and integrating with global best practices that ultimately raises the productivity of individuals.

[00:23:41] Um, and if you look at the, at the data on what actually happens, um, you know, when countries build up their diasporas, um, it's actually, uh, quite the opposite. It turns out that the larger diaspora a country has, the more successful they are in developing their own local economy and industries. And there's a few great examples of this. Um, probably the most intuitive is you look at India.

[00:24:05] So, uh, in the nineties and two thousands, um, Silicon Valley recruited tons of software developers, uh, from India to come work, uh, in California. Did, did India run out of software developers as a result of this process? Absolutely not. It was the complete opposite. Everyone in their nephew decided to train up to become a software developer. They invested more in their own education because they saw these global opportunities that were available for them.

[00:24:30] Um, and so this, you know, supply and demand effect where, um, actually if you increase the demand for a given skillset or a given set of talent, the supply is going to increase as well. Um, and more than that, if you actually look at the, the, the, the long run story, you know, of, um, these, the, these, uh, many software developers and engineers who ultimately moved to Silicon Valley. Um, some of them actually, uh, did go back and they ended up being the ones that built out the whole Indian tech ecosystem.

[00:24:58] And so it's this brain circulation, this exchange that is possible by having more open barriers and opportunities for individuals to follow whatever the best pathway for them is, um, to develop their careers and their opportunities that ultimately results in the most gain for everyone involved.

[00:25:16] Um, and so I think, you know, when we apply this in the, in the, the African, uh, talent economy perspective, it's the same concept where we need to be figuring out how can Africa's talent get more access to the global economy. And in some cases that might be building up local export manufacturing businesses. In other cases that might be going and, uh, working in industries overseas that are currently, uh, very short of certain talent and certain workforces.

[00:25:44] But in both cases, we see in the evidence, very, very strong net gains for the origin economy. And so that's why for the Africa jobs fund, you know, focused on this core KPI overall of how do we increase African worker incomes as much as possible. We want to be open to the full global set of opportunities that could be available for those African workers. So you've given great examples of how African countries can learn from those economies or examples.

[00:26:10] If we look at ethical labor mobility in practice, how do you actually ensure African workers are protected while creating these opportunities abroad? I think it's the same safeguards and expectations that you have for any work contract. So the, the, the, the core, core basic thing is you need to have transparency. So, you know, you should have a clear contract. What are your terms? What is your pay? Um, you know, what is it that you're going to do?

[00:26:37] And, you know, that contract needs to be respected and enforceable. Um, I think unfortunately where, you know, we have seen, you know, poor examples of, of, um, you know, international, uh, work opportunities gone wrong is, is where those rights are not in place and the contracts are, are not being respected and are not enforceable. And so I think to me, this is all the more reason why formalization of international labor mobility is the opportunity.

[00:27:04] Um, we know that just given the huge demand and the huge differences in, in income opportunities that international labor mobility is, is always going to happen, uh, whether you like it or not. I think the, the opportunity to formalize it is really what is going to unlock the most benefit for the workers who are the ones that ultimately can gain the most. If you can move overseas, um, and get, you know, 10, 20 X, the, the income that, uh, that you went at home.

[00:27:33] Um, you know, that is a life-changing opportunity that I think should be available to those who can benefit from it, but, um, it needs to be made available in a way that's transparent where you're actually going to do what you need to do. If there are costs involved, um, those are, are, are clearly, uh, indicated upfront and, and transparent in terms of what the obligations are. And then ultimately, if, uh, any of the terms are, are not being, uh, followed where you have redress and recourse to it.

[00:27:59] And that only happens when you operate within a formal system. And so I think, uh, for too long, um, uh, you know, people have just turned a blind eye to the fact that, um, you have these, these huge, um, you know, global mismatches, uh, in labor demand and supply. And they've allowed, uh, I think unscrupulous and, and, and, and sometimes, um, uh, very malevolent actors, um, to, to exploit, uh, people involved in the process.

[00:28:26] But if the industry can be formalized, if, um, players who are following the rules, um, can be supported and ultimately see, uh, market benefits, uh, from doing so. Then, uh, in the same way that, uh, you know, financing, uh, can be transformative and positive in what it unlocks for people, but can also be extremely exploitative. If, uh, people don't have all their alternatives and they have to rely on their, their local loan sharks.

[00:28:53] Um, it's the same thing in, in, in this industry as well, um, where, you know, if we can support the, the, the right kinds of, uh, businesses that are building up transparent ethical pathways, that can ultimately unlock a huge amount of positive returns and benefits, um, for the workers involved. I guess ultimately both manufacturing and labor mobility have one thing in common, you know, neither works without institutions that connect workers with opportunities, which obviously depends.

[00:29:23] Um, workforce infrastructure. And it's a phrase that appears repeatedly in the Africa jobs fund announcement, which is workforce infrastructure. So what does that actually mean in your context? I think when we think about workforce infrastructure, we're actually very focused on the demand side of ensuring that the needs of these markets are ultimately

[00:29:53] being designed for and, and, and the blockers within them are being solved. So, and this is a bit different from a lot of times when people talk about, uh, workforce development in the context of, of African economies. Um, they focus a lot on the supply side inputs. They say, Oh, we need, uh, improved education. We need more skills training. Um, I would say I have a slightly controversial take on this, which is, I don't think the bottleneck right now is on the education side.

[00:30:22] You know, if you look at the statistics, once again, you know, focusing on the data, there's something like 11 million youth who are joining the workforce in Africa every year, but only 2 million formal jobs being created. And of that 11 million, the majority of them are actually high school graduates. Millions of them are actually also now university graduates. So these are not people who are undereducated. Um, in fact, there are, there are huge amounts of people who graduate with these higher degrees, but there are no jobs waiting for them.

[00:30:51] So the, the bottleneck here is really on the demand side. It's on the, the, the actual kind of jobs that are there for, for people to work in. And I think if we kind of understand why is it that more jobs are not being created in these economies? Why is it that these youth who are graduating, you know, most of whom have strong educations already are not able to, to access, you know, high quality jobs. Um, and we work backwards from that problem.

[00:31:17] I think that's where we ultimately can create the most value in unlocking careers for the people who need them. Going back to the beginning in terms of launching the Africa jobs fund, rather than simply funding companies, you want to back founders, building, hiring corridors and workforce systems. So what kind of businesses specifically are you hoping to see entrepreneurs build? I'll give a few examples.

[00:31:43] So, um, on the labor mobility side, we are finalizing and, and, and looking at, uh, an investment that will be unlocking opportunities for hospitality workers in Kenya, um, to go work in the hospitality sector in Italy.

[00:32:01] Um, and so, uh, Kenya, in fact, already has a large industry specifically catering to Italian tourists, uh, to come down and, and, and enjoy, uh, especially the, the, the seaside area of Malindi in Kenya. Um, and so this is a perfect opportunity to take a workforce that already knows how to work with a given clientele, um, and actually, uh, help them access, uh, literally a 10 X in, in incomes, uh, doing the same kind of work in the same industry, um, in, in Italy.

[00:32:29] Um, and so we're backing, uh, the startup that is specifically going to be doing the recruitment and placement, um, to, to bring that pathway, uh, into existence. Uh, to give another example, uh, we're looking right now at an investment to set up a freeze dry fruit export business from Madagascar. Um, so Madagascar, um, is one of the largest, uh, producers, uh, uh, certain kinds of high value fruits in the world, uh, most notably lychee.

[00:32:58] Um, and however, uh, almost none of it gets exported. Um, so you have this very high value crop that is, uh, basically being consumed locally, even though it's, it's produced in, in, in excess. Um, but we could dramatically increase its value actually, uh, I think by something like 15 X, if we can figure out and set up the right kind of infrastructure, uh, freeze drying, uh, and logistics, um, to actually be able to get it, uh, so it'd be sold overseas.

[00:33:24] Um, and so that's just two of an example of, of, um, the flavors of businesses that we're backing. And, you know, for both of these, we're looking at the lens of how much income, new income opportunity does this represent in terms of the workforce that will access opportunities through these businesses. Um, so, uh, yeah, very much kind of casting a wide net, um, across these, uh, these two focus areas. So we've talked about creating jobs at scale and the type of businesses you're hoping to see entrepreneurs building.

[00:33:54] So what would you say separates a company capable of creating those productive jobs from one that is simply just growing revenue? I think the key difference is really this integration with global demand. So as I said, I think, I think there's a lot of businesses that you find that are, you know, growing domestically, you know, alongside the, the, the, the kind of general rate of, of population and, um, and GDP.

[00:34:19] And, you know, those are reasonable businesses, but they're not going to be the, the, the kinds of, of transformative scale up companies that ultimately generate the millions of jobs that are required. And so I think in order to really do that, you have to be tapping into the global economy.

[00:34:38] Um, and so that's where being an export manufacturer, um, figuring out what goods you can produce competitively to be sold overseas, um, and meet, you know, potentially the bottomless demand that, that, that, that could imply. Um, that's one huge way in which you can create a scale of business and, and transformative, uh, income opportunities for, for the workforce.

[00:34:58] Um, and the, the other way, as I said, is, is figuring out how, um, you can build bridges to meet the global demand, uh, for, for, for talent and labor in different, uh, different industries. Um, and so very different types of businesses, but ultimately, you know, both transformative outcomes, um, for, for workers, uh, in Africa who, you know, otherwise would be unemployed or, or very underemployed.

[00:35:20] So how will you actually measure the success? Is it job created wages, increased exports generated or something different? We're very focused on one KPI, which is the lifetime earnings increase of African workers.

[00:35:37] So, um, we really want to see, uh, and, and the bar that we've set for ourselves is, um, that for, for every dollar of capital, um, that, uh, African jobs fund is spending, we want, uh, to see at least $200 in African worker, uh, lifetime earnings increased.

[00:35:53] Um, so it's a very ambitious goal. Um, and, uh, you know, that, that, that means that, you know, if we're looking at, uh, at a hundred million dollar, uh, fund that we want to deploy, then, uh, you know, we're talking, uh, over $20 billion, uh, in, in, in African worker income increases, um, as a result of the, the activity that we want to undertake. Interesting. So how would you actually build the accountability and the structure around measuring those outcomes at such a scale?

[00:36:20] The measurement and evaluation approach, uh, that, that we're designing right now is basically looking at within the portfolio. We want to understand, um, what were the average incomes of the workers, um, before they, they started working, um, or going through, um, the benefiting from the services of the companies, um, that we're backing.

[00:36:41] Um, and so we, we, we hope to get a good representative baseline, um, for each company of, of, of, of the profile and previous earnings of, of the workforce that, that they're engaging. Uh, and then of course, um, we'll, uh, you know, follow, uh, those workers, um, once they are engaged with the company, um, and kind of see what the deltas are. And I think through that, you know, we'll get a really strong sense of, um, you know, what kind of economic transformation, um, does the portfolio represent, um, and, you know, uh, be able to extrapolate.

[00:37:11] That over time, as we back more and more businesses. And I think this will also help us hone in on the different types of businesses as well, in terms of which ones ultimately lead, um, to the most transformative outcomes for the workers that they, uh, that they work with. Brilliant. Brilliant. So I guess if we look into the future, the next chapter, if we can get something like this right on the continent, you know, over the next 20 years, what does success actually look like for you? Success is, is the lifetime earnings increase.

[00:37:41] So we're targeting this a hundred million, uh, over the next five years, um, which, uh, you know, hopefully we'll, we'll, we'll increase those lifetime earnings by over 20 billion in and of itself. But, uh, you know, even that of course is, is not enough. Um, when, when we think about just the sheer size of the, uh, the population that we want to unlock economic opportunities for.

[00:38:00] And so my hope would be if we're, uh, talking about what Africa jobs fund will have done over the next, uh, you know, 20 or so years, um, that it would be, you know, an order of magnitude, uh, more than that. So if we can get into, um, having unlocked hundreds of billions of dollars of earnings increases for African workers, then I think we'll be well on our way, uh, to, to having contributed in a small way to the, the essential work that needs to be done to improve livelihoods across the continent. Quote of the week.

[00:38:28] So finally, Daniel, I think you answered this question last time, but it might've changed. Seeming you're on a different path, a different journey. I know you've spent your career building businesses to solve difficult problems. As people, we often have quotes, mantras, proverbs, or philosophies that help guide us through uncertainty. Is there one that has stayed with you during this new path? Absolutely.

[00:38:55] I would say, you know, as I've decided to take on this difficult, challenging objective of figuring out how we can unlock whole new industries and job pathways and corridors across Africa, I've been consistently reminded of the famous quote from a president, uh, John F. Kennedy, who said, uh, we don't choose to do these things because they're easy, but because they are hard.

[00:39:22] And I think that's exactly the mindset that I've embraced, uh, when it comes to our goals and, uh, and purpose now. Uh, and so I'm excited to be putting in, uh, and doing the hard work and, uh, hopefully we'll see something come of it. Fantastic. Great way to end today's conversation. I think it's been a conversation that I've thoroughly enjoyed because it's definitely within my way of thinking.

[00:39:46] You know, some of the conversations I've been having over the years in terms of manufacturing or migration and how we can lift Africa economically to generate prosperity for not just a small percentage, but the wider population, which is something I'm hoping to see this fund achieve. So Daniel, absolute pleasure. And thank you for coming back and joining us on the podcast for the second time around. Thank you.

[00:40:15] Fantastic being here. Thank you to everyone who has listened and stay tuned to the podcast. If you've enjoyed this episode, please subscribe, share, or tell a friend about it. You can also rate, review us in Apple podcast or wherever you download your podcast. Thank you and see you next week for the unlocking Africa podcast.