The Future of Ecommerce in Africa and Why Speed and Reliability Is Everything with Dima Rasnovsky

[00:00:00] You're listening to the Unlocking Africa podcast.

[00:00:30] We want to become part of future infrastructure of cities we operate in. To make this happen, we need to be very consistent in quality of service and price just to make it happen. Stay tuned as we bring you inspiring people who are unlocking Africa's economic potential. You're listening to the Unlocking Africa podcast with your host, Terser Adamu.

[00:00:54] Welcome to another episode of the Unlocking Africa podcast where we explore the ideas, innovations and strategies that are unlocking Africa's economic potential. Today, my guest is Dima Rasnovsky, General Manager for Africa at Glovo, a pioneering multi-category platform connecting users with restaurants, supermarkets, retailers and couriers to deliver goods on demand across cities.

[00:01:21] But this is not simply a conversation about food delivery apps. It is about how digital platforms are reshaping everyday commerce across African cities, how technology, logistics and mobile payments are enabling neighbourhood businesses to reach customers in entirely new ways. And why the rise of quick commerce where products arrive in minutes rather than days could redefine the future of retail across the continent.

[00:01:49] And Dima, welcome, welcome, welcome to the Unlocking Africa podcast. How are you? I'm good. Thanks a lot for introduction. And yeah, I'm super excited and super excited to be part of this Unlocking Africa journey because the potential is really, really great. And for me, as somebody from Ukraine, we just started to discover Africa myself. I mean, I'm personally super excited. Fantastic. As always, I like to start from the beginning.

[00:02:17] So I was hoping you could give us an introduction to yourself and also Glovo as a company as well. Yeah, sure. So my name is Dima. I'm Ukrainian. I joined Glovo in 2018 as a general manager of Ukraine. And we were expanding very fast and growing very fast. It was a that time startup. Now we're not startup anymore. Probably we're a scale-up or just mature company.

[00:02:42] And in 2024, I joined African team to lead our business units on the continent. Also, fair to mention that we are present in six markets so far in Africa. It's Nigeria, Kenya, Uganda, Ivory Coast, Morocco, and Tunisia. And the continent is so huge that there is still so much space to grow and even in existing countries. So as you already mentioned, we're a three-sided marketplace.

[00:03:06] We are organizing or orchestrating operations for users between couriers and our partners. And we have very different types of merchants starting from restaurants, ending with, I don't know, flower shops. And more to come because our mission is to be the biggest online marketplace in our markets we operate. And in Africa, we see truly great opportunity because for some reason, there are no Amazons. And e-commerce is still on other stages.

[00:03:34] And we see that with help of merchants, we can enable e-commerce expansion and e-commerce growth on our markets we operate. Fantastic. As you mentioned, Glovo is a scale-up, expanding very quickly and fastly. With that in mind, you have to take advantage of some of the opportunities that come from emerging markets. So when you look across sub-Saharan Africa today, what would you say excites you most about opportunities that the continent presents?

[00:04:03] When you look on macro metrics, you already get excited. And I will just mention a few because probably they might be super obvious for you guys who live from Africa. But for somebody like from outside like me, I mean, like it was like mind-blowing. For instance, let's start from so-called African earthquake. When I see every change of what people in Kenya or Uganda or Nigeria, I say, wow, we are building the future together with so many young people.

[00:04:32] And there are so much energy. And all these people are adopting very modern behaviors, very modern habits. And you cannot see that in Europe. And for me, it's mind-blowing to see the fintech industry in Africa. So when I compare fintech in Africa compared to Europe, I mean, Africa is ahead despite all the limitations. And when you see smartphone penetration and when you look on many fundamentals, Africa is so much advanced.

[00:05:01] And there are so many micro-tailorings. And in parallel, this country is growing, GDP is growing. And it seems that all these children who will grow up soon, they will live in much richer Africa and much more technology-enabled. So when you look at that, you understand that there is a big economical future in Africa. And GDP will redistribute. And Africa will have a higher and bigger role in the world economy order very soon. And it's just a big tide which is coming.

[00:05:30] So you touched on something quite key there in terms of Africa having one of the youngest and fastest urbanizing populations in the world. How would you say from what you've seen, analyzed, research, how would you say this demographic trend is potentially reshaping consumer behavior? First of all, I think that in many senses, Africa is more digital native. And, you know, I mean, for me, it was like the first time I came to Africa.

[00:05:58] We went to one of the suburbs of Lagos in mainland, which seems pretty much undeveloped when you look like from European perspective. And then you go to a small pizza place, which is, I mean, like, like a really small place and not the best neighborhood. And then they tell you that they don't accept cash. You need to pay by card. They say, wow, can you imagine the same in any village of Spain or any neighborhood? I mean, it's just impossible.

[00:06:27] I mean, there are still many places in Barcelona, like where it's working vice versa for many reasons. And I believe one of the reasons is that a lot of young population adopting a lot of these kind of habits. And they already like world is super globalized. So whenever you live, like Africa, Asia, Europe, there is a lot of knowledge. And many young Africans building a very modern future for their countries. And that's why they're adopting the affibits.

[00:06:57] And for me, probably it was a revelation, I would say. And like, I mean, the bigger part of Africa is already digital native. Yeah. So I guess keeping on the theme of the whole digital native perspective, we know that in more mature markets, e-commerce has had time to gradually develop. That infrastructure as well has had time to develop alongside the digital aspects.

[00:07:22] But do you think Africa could potentially leapfrog some of that and go straight into a digital first commerce kind of ecosystem? I think it's already happening because of, I mean, despite a lot of headwinds, but there are a lot of infrastructure issues. So because for many reasons, there is no huge CAPEX budgets available to build all the grocery chains or even electrify all the places and cities.

[00:07:51] And I mean, that's why there is, I mean, Africa cannot go the same way as Europe or even China did just by design. And that's why I believe that Africa will leapfrog certain stages, like it happened with desktop. I mean, there was no desktop in Africa. You guys jumped directly to mobile and similar things are happening in e-commerce. How it will happen? I don't know. But as I said, it's super cool to be part of this journey.

[00:08:20] And one of my beliefs that probably Africa will leapfrog in a very much quick commerce game, much faster than Europe, US or any other parts of the world. How is a different question? Because again, as I say, when you see that in certain areas of even big cities like Lagos, there are issues with connectivity or issues with electricity. I mean, it's clear that in certain structure solutions will be some, it will be different.

[00:08:46] Or when I take modern trades development, like number of supermarkets per capita or number of supermarkets per kilometer. I mean, like it's totally undeveloped and it's a bit limited in the growth. At the same time, CAPEX are there. So meaning that there will be some way of solving it. What will survive? What will be the best way? We will see soon. And I mean, Africa is moving very fast and it's interesting to see how things will be shaped.

[00:09:14] As you mentioned before, you're from Ukraine and obviously this experience with Glovo is your first kind of foray into the African market. So what were some of the misconceptions that you had or people had about the continent before you went in, looked and saw yourself? What is actually happening on ground? Probably first of all, I would say that it's not even misconceptions. It's a, we need to go to, we need to make a step back. It's probably lack of awareness of many things.

[00:09:45] First of all, you know, we say a lot, Africa, Africa, Africa, but I mean, Africa is so big continent. It's so different than for me, you know, like when you look on the map, you think that Africa is like even smaller than Russia. Just because of the way Africa is being on the map. But then when I realized that from Abidjan to Nairobi, there are more kilometers than between Spain, between Barcelona and Kiev and Ukraine.

[00:10:14] I mean, it tells you that even in the SSA, things are much more different than in Europe. And it's like, like understanding this is also already a big thing. And for me, it was a revelation, you know, like people in Kenya or Nigeria or in every coast are so different in terms of behaviors. I mean, it's so interesting.

[00:10:34] And probably this one second, I think that people don't understand that or that in many areas, Africa is just more developed again, like FinTech or what is happening now in climate tech in Africa. It's super, so exciting and it's not happening in all the parts of the world. So here we see that the continent in certain domains areas is going to be in a different direction. And I mean, all people need to learn. And probably also I don't realize the size of young population.

[00:11:03] Again, like probably it's not misconception, it's just like awareness. But when you go deep, when you go to the cities, when you meet people, when you talk to people, you understand, wow, things are brewing here and things are moving very fast here. I guess one of the things which I want to touch on today is an area that you guys are focusing on quite intently, which is quick commerce. Yes.

[00:11:27] So I wanted to see if you could introduce the concept of quick commerce and why you think it matters globally and specifically in Africa. So, I mean, the concept is that let's go back into the history. So one of the revolutions Amazon made in US when they said that we will deliver you things tomorrow because back in the day you had to wait one week to get parcel in US. And when they introduced delivering tomorrow, they deserved the market.

[00:11:55] I mean, it was a huge shift and, you know, like, for instance, I am a big user of Amazon in Spain. And of course, by default, I expect to get things tomorrow. It's like a standard. Now, what is happening with players like Glovo? That when we enable local merchants with local presence, I mean, we by design make fast delivery. We make delivery like below 45 minutes.

[00:12:17] We started, of course, from restaurants, but now a big chunk of our business is other categories, supermarkets, pharmacies, electronics, whatever. And we deliver below 45 minutes. And here we come into quick commerce. So we're delivering not next day or in two days, but we're delivering like within an hour. And for me, I can give you an example like from my experience in Barcelona. It sounds dumb, but at the same time, it's somehow magical. For instance, I need to buy my new AirPods. I have choices.

[00:12:47] Go to Amazon and get them tomorrow. I can go to Media Markt or Fnac tomorrow or like in two days. Or I can go to Glovo and order from Fnac or Media Markt and get same AirPods at very same price, but in 45 minutes. And in my case, I'm getting them in 20 minutes because you don't need to cook AirPods and the store is two kilometers away from me. And you're wow. It's a big difference.

[00:13:13] So if I can order not only food, but whatever I want in 45 minutes, it's another type of disruption. I don't need to plan things and I can fulfill my needs at any point. And when we come back to your previous questions, where Africa can leapfrog, I think that Africa can leapfrog e-commerce going directly to quick commerce. Because e-commerce penetration in the majority of markets is pretty low due to many reasons.

[00:13:37] And now when we enable more and more merchants also in many markets we work with. And like in Kenya, we have many partners in cosmetics in Parma. I mean, or in Nigeria. So meaning that at some point you'll be able to order whatever you need, which fits nine kilo bags of the courier, literally in 45 minutes. If there is a merchant with this category.

[00:14:04] Meaning that probably share of e-commerce, share of e-commerce, internal size of e-commerce will be much higher than in Europe, US and whatever the place. And this is also super exciting because there is a high trend that e-commerce will be e-commerce standards for Africa. Not classical e-commerce which we have in Europe or in US. And it's also very much exciting because it will explain things. For this we need volume, for this we need, again, right amount of merchants.

[00:14:32] It's not always the case in all the places because in some cities, even with one in the population, there are neighborhoods where he dogs on these places. At the same time, it's happening and there are many places how to enable this. As you mentioned, quick commerce promises delivery within minutes or hours. Why would you say speed has become so central to modern retail? You know, I think it's also just probably a result of two things. I mean, technology.

[00:15:00] Because when we commerce started, there was no mobile. You didn't have a GPS. You could not track many things. Second, it was small. And it was very expensive to have many couriers on the ground. When we built a pretty big business, a relevant business in restaurants, we already have a lot of couriers. And these couriers need orders during non-peak hours because people usually eat during lunch and dinner. And in between, they don't need food.

[00:15:26] So we already have some kind of, not idle fleet, but underutilized fleet. Right? And then we have already a lot of them which helps us to enable fast delivery. Meaning that to get fast delivery, you don't need to actually overpay. And then you have another side of network effect because when you get a great service, fast at relatively low price, I mean, and with good quality of delivery, it increases your trust. It increases your appetite. Now you think, okay, do I want to go to a store or for me it's just easier to order?

[00:15:56] And it increases frequency. And then it impacts again. We need, we build bigger fleet. We can pay more to couriers. And it's like flywheel which is reinforcing the industry and the whole ecosystem. So would you say African consumers are adopting quick commerce at the same pace as markets in Europe or Asia? I mean, it depends how to count. But how would I say?

[00:16:20] For instance, if I take share of quick commerce business from total business in Kenya or like Uganda, it will be higher than in many European countries. Why? It's partially also driven. Imagine like you, you cannot order online certain categories just because you don't have classical commerce. And suddenly Glovo appears or any other operator like Glovo and you can order. And of course, it pushes you to get frequency because, I mean, there are no other choices.

[00:16:48] Also, I mean, the industry is just simply underdeveloped. And it's much easier to grow there. Because in Spain, the players are harder. There is Amazon, but there are other players. And Africa in many senses is a greenfield. Yes, greenfield with many structural issues. But also, the good thing about Africa is that there are so many young populations who are open to try new things.

[00:17:12] Compared again to Europe, when you have a lot of old people who have old habits and the swifers in Europe still, there are many cases popular deliveries or taxi when you just have to call. Younger generations like millennials, Gen Z, Gen Alpha, they don't want to call. They want to use the app. So would you say the model in Africa is evolving differently to the model in Asia or Europe?

[00:17:38] Yeah, because of more younger population, because of other type of infrastructure and probably other type of overall industry development. So that's why I think that the mix is different and the pace is different. At the same time, many fundamentals are still the same. And people want to get what they want at the lowest possible price as fast as they can and as much as many options as they can. Because, for instance, when I talk to my colleagues in different countries, I'm asking, okay, how would you buy a phone?

[00:18:06] Or how would you buy your new Nike shoes? I mean, there are not many options. Service is not great. And it's just we do normal service orders at the app with a high level of trust, quality, and good prices already created the big markets. So if we keep on the theme of the model, one of the interesting aspects of Glovo is how it connects neighborhoods, businesses, and digital consumers.

[00:18:32] So how important would you say those small, medium, and local retailers are to your Africa model? For me, it's a cornerstone of the model because here also we have interesting economical networks, in fact, imagine, so let's go back to example, Amazon or big, big retailer. So you go there, you order something, and something is coming from a big warehouse, shipped from another country. So because it's cheaper, more economies of scale, and that's it.

[00:19:00] In our case, when you look with SMB, and you order things from local merchants, you support local economy and local producer. And you don't support somebody very big. And that's why you support market fragmentation, and you support market competition. And usually in many neighborhoods, you have a lot of local merchants. And now, for instance, like, for me, it's a choice. If I order my AirPods from Amazon, most probably they will come from Amazon warehouse, which was shipped from the US.

[00:19:28] When I buy from Fnod, I'm supporting local chain, which will pay taxes to chain. Or even better, if I order AirPods from a smaller store, I will support local entrepreneur. And the same happens in Africa. You have a lot of small shops, and actually, like, there are some chains, but there are not many of them. And in this way, when we have strong SMB, we support them. They get more orders, more revenues, and then they will be able to expand.

[00:19:54] But also, they are able to spend more and improve infrastructure around. And it's also reinforcing the whole ecosystem. Because, I mean, in many cities, there are still many things to do in terms of infrastructure or offering inside every neighborhood. Because there are some developed neighborhoods, there are some less developed neighborhoods. So, and I think it's a really magical part of being hyper-local marketplace. For us to build a working business, we need to win neighborhood by neighborhood.

[00:20:21] I mean, for instance, if we are strong in Nairobi's CBD, it doesn't help us to make a great service in Tokaran, another neighborhood of Nairobi. Or if I have a good service or good restaurants and supermarkets or whatever, in Leki, in Lagos, it doesn't help me in Unilag on mainland.

[00:20:46] And this is, I think, also a pretty cool part which forces us to go piece by piece and be super laser-focused on what is happening on the ground in every neighborhood. So you mentioned that small businesses are critical to your business model. So when a small retailer joins Glovo, what kind of transformations do you typically see in the business in terms of the way it operates? I think it's several things.

[00:21:15] Like, probably think number one that they're getting a bit more data-driven because even from us, they get some information like about bad reviews, about quality of operation, getting other things, some benchmarks. And they're becoming just more organized in a certain way because they're getting more inputs. Also, for us, a perfect scenario when we're able to drive a good amount of orders to this merchant. And when is that happening, it's a good starting point to have a conversation on why is that happening. Is it a problem of platform?

[00:21:45] Is it a problem of pricing or products or whatever? And usually, we're able to provide some benchmarks. But in general, I think that whenever you digitalize another part of the business, it's helping you to get stronger in other parts of the business, just through the data, through technology, and so on and so forth. Fantastic. So, I mean, we've touched on the digitalization of the businesses or the online element. So, we can't ignore the offline elements,

[00:22:15] which is quite crucial to business in Africa in terms of logistics and last mile delivery. So, how have you managed to navigate that big challenge that many infrastructure, e-commerce, any type of delivery platform has encountered in terms of last mile delivery? How have you managed to navigate that challenge? Honestly, I cannot say that in terms of last mile delivery, we've felt any dramatical new challenge. Actually, from logistics standpoint,

[00:22:44] from my previous experience, I had many other problems. Like, for instance, like windows in Ukraine or in Kazakhstan. I mean, it's also pretty challenging. And, of course, in some markets, we saw some education problems when couriers or people who wanted to be couriers didn't know how to use Google Maps. So, for us, probably it was an extra challenge how to help people to get basic knowledge of using tools which will help them to deliver this.

[00:23:14] At the same time, I mean, frankly speaking, I cannot say that it was a big challenge. It's different. There are some specifics. Yes, but same challenges we have in any other country because organizing, orchestrating, last mile delivery on the scale, it requires a lot of right technology in place. But at the same time, many things are being solved through technology. And probably that's why Glovo and many other operators in the field are striving because having quite technology in place,

[00:23:43] you are disrupting the industry. Also, probably I can mention that in some countries, there is a category of people who want to be couriers but they don't have smartphone. It's also one of the challenges. At the same time, in all this country, there are many strong players who help people to get credits, to get phone, I mean, or vehicle, or I mean, there are solutions. And again, Africa is evolving. But also, now you're reflecting on your question,

[00:24:13] I cannot say that I felt that operations in Africa are much more challenging than in all the countries. I mean, I would say that I mentioned market problems and I saw it in Central Asia as well or in Caucasus. So, yeah, we just need to do our job, we need to scale business, we need to improve our technology. I mean, business as usual. Yeah. You mentioned something quite interesting in terms of challenges that you faced outside of Africa,

[00:24:43] winters in Ukraine and Kazakhstan. So, are there any specific lessons that you learned outside of Africa that you've brought with you that you found quite effective? You know, first of all, I think that here I need to give context. I joined Glover without food delivery experience. I was working more in the cosmetics industry before, like in companies like L'Oreal. And, before coming to Africa, I had to learn how to operate food delivery. And in general, when I joined Glover in 2018, there were no books

[00:25:13] about food delivery. And now, there are no books about food delivery. And the mind was very new and we had to learn how to operate a three-sided marketplace. Because, I mean, network effects are working differently. And, I mean, I think that, I cannot say that I learned something specific. I just learned the industry how to operate it. And, of course, when I came to Africa, I had a lot of wrong opinions on how we need to operate. But, they're also very much straightforward. For instance, you always will put up sufficient fleet.

[00:25:43] If you cannot deliver the sync, you'll destroy trust between you and users. That's why having stable fleet and good operations is critical. Or, if you have nothing to order from your application, nobody will order. That's why it's super difficult to have the right amount of merchants inside the application. And, yes, it's challenging that probably it's not enough stores compared to Europe. At the same time, whenever I go to Africa, I see that people are used to get out, eating out. So, majority of people that don't cook, they go out.

[00:26:13] And, there are a lot of places that we just need to find a way how to work with them. And, yes, if you have a popular restaurant, which is not electrified, and then using cold food, yes, it's by default more challenging. At the same time, rules of the game are the same. You need to get a restaurant to the platform, if it's popular, and then you get demands from users. So, probably, I would say that, you know, is to give an analogy, you know, it's like playing football. I learned how to play football, but then I came to Africa

[00:26:43] and understood that I'm playing not football, I'm playing beach football. Rules are more of the same, but terrain is different. And I need to readjust myself, but principles are still the same. You highlighted the importance of a stable fleet, so outside of that, what else would you say you've learned about building reliable logistic systems in these environments? Yeah, yeah, it's like, imagine, people usually, all the people, they have many barriers. Imagine, you're hungry, and you said, okay, I will use blow this time. But you think, oh,

[00:27:13] but if they fuck up my order, what I'm going to do is barrier number one. You open the app, it's hard to make a choice, then you finally made a choice, then you say, wow, I need to pay like delivery fee or something like that, another barrier, and you still don't know how reliable at all or not. And then you say, oh, they also want to get my cards. Is it legit? Are they legit? Can I pay with my cards? So you already have so many barriers. Finally, you think, okay, well, I will do it. You place an order

[00:27:42] with all the doubts in your head, and we deliver your order cold in 70 minutes. Of course, you will turn. You will say, no, food delivery is not working, glow is coming to me. And to reduce number of that experiences, we need to work hard. Otherwise, if we don't create trust, I mean, it's impossible to operate. And so far in Africa, our frequency is like between three and six orders per month. That's why, imagine like, if we pack up like two orders out of three or two out of six,

[00:28:12] there is no trust and people turn. At the same time, their unit economics is not working because in many cases for us, cost-style acquisition cost is pretty high. And for us, to make unit economics work, we need to make eight, 10, 11 orders from the same user. And to make this work, we need to be very good in consistency of our experience. And it's not always easy. And it's one of the challenges we are working on because here, there is so much space to improve. That's great to hear.

[00:28:41] Earlier, you mentioned in terms of how Africa is greenfield, there's less competitors than say Europe and Asia. But we know over the years, several e-commerce companies have come and gone in order to found the African market to challenging and have not generated the type of revenue that they anticipated. What lessons would you say that Glovo has probably learned from some of those companies that have come and gone before it? First of all, I think it depends on what you're expecting from Africa.

[00:29:12] If you expect short-term returns, I think it's just a long expectation. For me, it's a long-term game. All micro is telling us that opportunity is here. But if it's opportunity you can monetize right here, right now without changing habits, making education, I mean, building systems which meet local requirements and local challenges, I think that we were very much aware that we won't be able

[00:29:42] to grasp opportunity faster. And probably this type of managed expectation helped us to focus on different things. So, secondly, I think that another difference that we rely a lot on local talent, and when you rely on local talent, you have less problems, B, your learning curve is much higher and you understand better what to expect or what will happen soon on the markets

[00:30:11] or what we need to do to get some reasonable short-term returns but, I mean, you know, still focusing on long-term. And when I compare to many other e-commerce players, I mean, share of how locals have count is usually bigger versus HQ and my peers. If I take all my team, majority of people are based in Africa and they're Africans. Despite myself being based in Barcelona and HQ. Interesting, interesting. So, that's why, yeah, I think it's

[00:30:40] more about expectations. But again, I'm sure that, I don't know when, but if we do our job well, Nigeria will be the biggest market for Glovo just because of all macro. Or at least the biggest one in number of transactions because by GDP size, Italy is the biggest by number of population in Nigeria. So, if we do things right, inevitably, Nigeria will be number one in number of transactions in Glovo. But again, I don't know when it will happen. Yeah, yeah. I guess despite seeing some

[00:31:10] large players come and go over the years, we are seeing a lot more local, smaller startups, global platforms also such as yourself coming in and some of those cross-border players also entering the space. So how do you see the whole e-commerce, quick commerce space evolving in Africa over the next couple of years?

[00:31:43] time, time it confirms there is a big appetite in Africa for reliable service and good assortment at the proper price. So, and TMO, Express, Shein, I just demonstrated that. And this just shows that locally the need was not fulfilled. That's why it was easy for cross-border to develop. So, also Africa is huge. I think that all of these players are doing very important things in education of the markets

[00:32:13] and the shape in the market. So, I'm sure that in the future the market will be fragmented because so many people, so many different habits, so many different income situations. And I don't know which segment will win. I believe that we will coexist at the same time. I believe that with the proper infrastructure improvements, Africa will just sleepwalk and the quick commerce and all guys like TMO, AliExpress or whoever else, they will just have super big warehouses

[00:32:41] in key cities and they will also be levered fast. But anyway, let's see. It's an interesting question and I'm also looking forward to learn what will happen, but it's an interesting part of the job. But again, I'm sure that all the segments will extend in nearly 25 years. But let's see. I don't think that the truth is that me and my team and teams of our competitors or teams of other e-commerce

[00:33:11] players we're shaping the future. It also depends on how good we're in executing things, how good we're in grasping needs, and how we're good on acting on that. because if we do our job well, we will define the future in a good way. So let's see. I see that more and more talent get involved into building and innovating in Africa. So I'm super curious because also as a Ukrainian for me it's interesting to see that there are Ukrainian businesses coming to Africa.

[00:33:42] For instance, one guy now is launching the bank, NeoBank in Nigeria. Also, gg.ng is the biggest classified. He's also Ukrainian, also present in Kenya. So it's interesting to see. Many people start to realize the opportunity, but then it depends who will execute their vision of the future in a better way or in a faster way. Fantastic. What I read is that Glovo's vision is to give people access to anything

[00:34:12] within their city on demand. So from an African perspective, how close would you say we are to that reality? Africa is growing fast and I had to reconsider my expectations already several times. At the same time, I think that it's still a lot to play, 3, 5, 10 years, but certain issues will go faster, certain issues will go slower. It also depends on many things which we don't know, but what I'm sure is that

[00:34:41] Africa will move very fast. Why I'm a bit cautious with Africa? Because in Kenya, you have 70 million people. And we know Glover is a part of Delivery Hero and Delivery Hero is present in many markets, probably around 100. And we are present in various Asian countries like Pakistan, Korea, whatever. And when we compare markets, we see the cloud. I mean, you can get to 60-70% penetration. But the question mark,

[00:35:11] when 50 millions of Canadians will start using quick commerce for delivery, will it take 10 years or will it take 15 years? And I don't know. I just can make a bet that Africa will grow much faster than any other geography. And of course, there are, again, also, I don't want to oversimplify. Africa is super different and there are different countries. And when I look at North Africa, it's closer to Europe in many senses. And in South Saharan Africa, there are different countries with different

[00:35:40] appetite. countries like Nigeria or Kenya, I believe they will grow super fast and get to that reality faster than many other countries. And what contribution do you hope Glovo will make to that change? No, I hope that we will be part of this game. Because, you know, I think me and my team will enjoy a lot the positive impact we do because when you create opportunities for many couriers who cannot have another job just because it's not available, or when you drive more sales to

[00:36:10] local merchants and making them thrive, or when you just solve a problem with the user who now can just order things, I mean, it's great. And we want to keep impacting this in a good way. And yes, we want to become part of future infrastructure of cities where operate into. But of course, to make this happen, we need to be very consistent in quality of service and pricing and many other dimensions just to make it happen.

[00:36:39] quote of the week. As people, we often have quotes, mantras, African proverbs, affirmations that keep us going when times are good or when times are challenging. Do you have one that you can share with us today? So, like, affirmation. Okay, probably what I tell to my team and was repeating recently a lot that information becomes knowledge only when you act on it. And, you know, we know so many things, but when we don't act on

[00:37:08] this, I mean, nothing happens. This information is right away. And there are so many signals around that if you want to use this information as a knowledge, you need to act on it and practice it. And the world is super fast. So Africa, there's so much context. Also now this thing with AI, which is enabling many processes, I mean, if you don't practice, if you don't try things, I mean, it's not becoming a knowledge. And also second thing, probably what I keep saying that to get new pieces of information, you need to

[00:37:38] act. So if you have a choice to do nothing or to do something, it's always to do something. Because even if you fail, you learn something. So I think we need to always keep initiative in things we do, even if they will lead to something else. But even having feathers, you have new pieces of information which you can transform into practical knowledge. Wise words, and thank you for your sharing that wisdom with us, Dima. I think from this conversation it's quite clear that the future of commerce in Africa is not

[00:38:08] simply replicating models from elsewhere. It's about how it will be shaped by our own cities, entrepreneurs, technologies, and also the African consumers. So thank you for joining me on the podcast today. It has been an absolute pleasure and look forward to seeing how Glovo develops and grows within Africa. Yeah, thank you a lot for inviting and yeah, super curious what we will see in Africa in two, three, five years. So I'm

[00:38:38] super happy to be part of it. Thank you to everyone who has listened and stayed tuned to the podcast. If you've enjoyed this episode, please subscribe, share, or tell a friend about it. You can also rate, review us in Apple Podcasts or wherever you download your podcast. Thank you and see you next week for the Unlocking Africa podcast.