Closing Africa’s Insurance Gap: Using an Agent-Driven Model to Transform How Insurance Is Sold in Africa With Jihan Abass

[00:00:00] You're listening to the Unlocking Africa Podcast.

[00:00:03] Our objective with LAMI was to change the entire insurance ecosystem and transform the process of purchasing insurance by digitizing it.

[00:00:12] Comparing how it was in the past, the 1-20 days process of getting insured, you're able to actually get a quotation in less than a minute and you're able to onboard a customer in less than two minutes.

[00:00:21] It took us many conversations to find investors that were interested in investing in our business, who understood the potential of what InsurTech can do for the insurance ecosystem in Africa.

[00:00:33] And I think there's also going to be a change in the perception of insurance. People are going to understand the benefits in more detail.

[00:00:40] Stay tuned as we bring you inspiring people who are unlocking Africa's economic potential.

[00:00:46] Stay tuned as we welcome to the Unlocking Africa Podcast.

[00:00:51] Welcome to the Unlocking Africa Podcast, where we find inspirational people who are doing inspirational things to unlock Africa's economic potential.

[00:01:06] Today, we have Jihan Abbas, who is CEO and founder of LAMI, which is an insurance as a service platform that digitizes the entire economy.

[00:01:16] It's a great insurance process and allows users to create and distribute digital insurance products.

[00:01:23] Welcome, welcome, welcome, Jihan. How are you?

[00:01:25] I'm great, thank you. Thanks so much for having me here.

[00:01:28] Absolutely. Pleasure to have you on the podcast. So where are you calling from today?

[00:01:33] I'm actually in Nairobi at the moment, which is where we're based with LAMI.

[00:01:37] Fantastic. And looking forward to hearing more about Nairobi and the work that you're doing with LAMI.

[00:01:43] So before we get started, I was hoping you could introduce yourself and tell us a bit more about Jihan Abbas.

[00:01:51] So my name is Jihan. I'm originally from Kenya, so I grew up down at the coast in Mombasa.

[00:01:57] Prior to starting LAMI, my background was actually in finance.

[00:02:00] So I was working as a commodities trader in London and then had a very random encounter when I came home to Mombasa over the Christmas holiday with a waiter who told me he's never had any kind of insurance in his life.

[00:02:14] And that actually got me, you know, starting to do a lot of research around the insurance space, which is how I ended up setting up LAMI.

[00:02:22] Fantastic. So as you mentioned, originally from Kenya, Mombasa, background in finance, and it was a chance encounter for waiter to kind of spark the inspiration for LAMI.

[00:02:33] I was hoping we can go from the very beginning in terms of you are the CEO and founder of LAMI.

[00:02:40] Give us a bit more information about the company, what it is that you do.

[00:02:46] Sure. So I set up LAMI in January of 2020. That's when we launched our first product.

[00:02:52] So I set up LAMI, myself and my co-founder, Roy, who's based out of London.

[00:02:56] Our objective was really to democratize access to insurance products.

[00:03:00] You know, an interesting statistic is that less than 3% of people in Africa actually have access to insurance products or even insured.

[00:03:08] So our objective with LAMI was to sort of change the entire insurance ecosystem and transform the process of purchasing insurance by digitizing it.

[00:03:18] So our main method of doing that is really by empowering insurance agents.

[00:03:23] So these are intermediaries that are selling insurance products because we believe that, you know, they play a critical role in the last mile delivery of insurance products across Africa.

[00:03:32] Fantastic. So you've detailed the initial aim or problem you were trying to solve in Africa's insurance market.

[00:03:41] So how did you initially identify there was a gap in the market for what you wanted to offer?

[00:03:47] Yeah, I think what was really interesting when we looked at essentially looking at the Kenyan market is that in Kenya, for example, there's 51 insurance companies that are operating in the market.

[00:03:57] But the insurance penetration level is about 2.8 percent.

[00:04:02] So, you know, what I didn't understand is why there were so many underwriters, why there were so many product options, but very few people who are actually purchasing insurance products.

[00:04:12] And I think some of the things that we saw is that, you know, a lot of people living in rural areas.

[00:04:16] So there's a very large rural population.

[00:04:19] You know, there's also low financial literacy when it comes to things like insurance products.

[00:04:24] People don't really want to purchase insurance products because, you know, you're paying for something today for something that may or may not happen in the future.

[00:04:32] So a lot of people, you know, they find it difficult to comprehend that.

[00:04:35] And then there's just generally a lot of friction with purchasing insurance products in the market.

[00:04:40] So it usually, you know, at the time when we were setting up, it could take anywhere from one to 20 days to purchase an insurance policy, which is, you know, a very long time to wait to be insured.

[00:04:50] Yes.

[00:04:51] So those are some of the things that we saw that made it quite exciting, the use of technology quite exciting to sort of transform how the insurance process is done.

[00:05:01] So you mentioned it usually takes one to 20 days to purchase insurance.

[00:05:06] What is it that causes the long lead time or delay in the process?

[00:05:12] So traditionally what would happen is that, you know, the quotation processes was fully manual.

[00:05:17] So what happens is that myself as a customer would go to an insurance intermediary or an agent or broker or a branch of an insurance company.

[00:05:25] I would request a different like a policy and then I would have to wait for them to provide me with the quotation.

[00:05:32] So that can take a couple of days for them to compile.

[00:05:35] It's done by hand where they calculate the premiums and then they would send you basically an offer of, you know, potentially what the price would be.

[00:05:43] And you can imagine that you want to have more than one option, even for agents going to their customers.

[00:05:48] They want to have more than one option.

[00:05:50] So they would have to go to about, you know, three to five insurance companies to get these options for their customers.

[00:05:56] By the time they've compiled all of that, they've onboarded the customer.

[00:06:00] It can be a few weeks even.

[00:06:02] I understand.

[00:06:03] So how have you gone about removing this bottleneck to make the process a lot more efficient and frictionless for the customer?

[00:06:11] So what we wanted to do with LAMI was essentially create an end-to-end insurance gateway.

[00:06:17] So an end-to-end journey that digitizes the whole value chain.

[00:06:20] So we have integrated various insurance companies, reinsurers, all the third-party services that you might need to process a policy.

[00:06:28] And then we have the core LAMI platform, which is essentially the insurance capabilities that we've built,

[00:06:34] where we have our own pricing engines, product engines, digital onboarding journey, renewal management,

[00:06:41] all of these different items that make sure that the process is super seamless.

[00:06:44] And comparing how it was in the past, the one to 20 days process of getting insured,

[00:06:50] you're able to actually get a quotation in less than a minute and you're able to onboard a customer in less than two minutes.

[00:06:55] So it's really a big change in terms of the customer journey or the agent journey for providing quotations to their customers.

[00:07:04] We also fully manage the KYC process on behalf of the insurance company.

[00:07:08] So there's really minimal admin related work during the process now if an agent is using our platform, for example.

[00:07:16] Earlier, you mentioned there are 51 insurance companies in Kenya.

[00:07:20] Do any of them use a unique agent-driven model that you use at LAMI?

[00:07:26] A lot of these insurance companies, so right now on our platform, we have about 40 under insurance companies offering products.

[00:07:33] A lot of them, they work with agents, but there's about 14,000 agents in the local market.

[00:07:38] So you can imagine that the insurance companies have to have large teams to manage agents,

[00:07:43] to manage those relationships, to manually prepare quotations.

[00:07:47] So a lot of these insurance companies, it actually costs them more to distribute directly to the agents than to use our platform.

[00:07:54] So what we see is that a lot of insurance companies are actually very excited to have a streamlined process of accessing this large pool of agents

[00:08:01] that we've been able to onboard onto our platform.

[00:08:03] And it also formalizes the relationship between themselves and the agents because it's just well structured for them.

[00:08:09] So sticking to the theme of the agent-driven approach, I believe you pivoted to this approach.

[00:08:17] So I was wondering how it's changed or transformed your business and why you think this approach works on the continent?

[00:08:25] I think that, you know, you see this not only in insurance, but in a lot of different products being sold in the market.

[00:08:31] Financial products, I mean.

[00:08:33] An agent is really a critical part of the last mile delivery of certain financial products and even of telco services, for example.

[00:08:41] So what we have seen in terms of the insurance space in particular is that these agents were,

[00:08:47] they were really struggling to grow as a business.

[00:08:50] You know, these are sole proprietors, they own small businesses.

[00:08:53] They were finding it difficult to grow because of the time that they were spending managing the admin work

[00:08:59] related to the process of selling insurance products.

[00:09:01] So, you know, we had built this technology over the last five years and we were using this technology internally.

[00:09:08] So we had our own agent platform, but we were using it for our internal sales.

[00:09:12] But we decided to test out and see whether it could be viable for external agents to use our platform for distribution.

[00:09:19] And we saw that actually it solves a lot of problems for them from the process of getting quotations,

[00:09:24] things like premium collections, which is managed by our platform.

[00:09:27] And another pain point that they were facing is that they have to wait a month to receive their commissions.

[00:09:32] They have to wait for insurance companies to reconcile their books before paying out commission.

[00:09:36] Sometimes it can even take up to two months.

[00:09:38] And through our platform, they receive these payments at the end of the day because it's all automated.

[00:09:42] So we did see a lot of growth initially when we piloted.

[00:09:46] And then we decided to pivot the business into this channel.

[00:09:50] And so far, we've been adding additional features, new features for the agents to support them, to help them grow further.

[00:09:57] Brilliant.

[00:09:58] So could you just briefly talk us through how this digital agent network is structured in terms of in relation to your company, where they sit?

[00:10:07] So at the moment, a lot of the agents that are on our platform are mostly from two main cities, Nairobi and Mombasa.

[00:10:15] We've started to recently onboard agents in other cities outside of those two larger cities.

[00:10:22] And anyone who's an agent who's licensed as an insurance distributor is able to join our platform, basically.

[00:10:28] So it isn't that they are sort of tied to us in any way.

[00:10:32] They are just doing their business as usual, except they have more efficiency in the process.

[00:10:37] So they're really in control of how they manage their day-to-day and their business as a whole.

[00:10:43] Thank you for sharing that.

[00:10:44] So you mentioned the agents are mainly in urban areas such as Nairobi and Mombasa.

[00:10:50] So I was wondering in terms of how would you go about as an organization bridging the insurance gap across, say, remote rural areas?

[00:11:01] Yeah, I would say that the agent model is really critical, particularly in those rural areas.

[00:11:07] The reason why we started with Nairobi and Mombasa is because it was easier for us to begin there since our offices are even based in Nairobi.

[00:11:16] But of course, in the rural areas is where there's a very limited branch network of a lot of insurance companies and a very limited offering in terms of products as well.

[00:11:25] So what we've been doing is we've slowly been activating new cities.

[00:11:30] So, for example, last week we activated a city called Kisumu and Eldoret, which are more rural cities in Kenya.

[00:11:38] And I think that, you know, in those areas you have a bigger, you'll definitely have a bigger impact because there's limited offerings of products, insurance options as well.

[00:11:47] Some of the people that we met or agents that I had onboarded during those trips had never sold, you know, tier one or large insurance providers in those areas before because they just don't have the relationships.

[00:11:59] So it's exciting to be able to offer them those options that they haven't had in the past.

[00:12:04] I was wondering if we can go in more detail regarding that in terms of these strategies that you've used or you found effective to reach what you'd probably call the last mile customers and connecting with them in remote areas.

[00:12:19] Yeah, I think it's really about the agents that you onboard.

[00:12:23] They're agents that, you know, specialize within certain regions.

[00:12:27] They sell insurance products in those regions.

[00:12:29] And the key thing for us is making sure that the process is as seamless as possible for the onboarding journey.

[00:12:36] But a lot of I think the main reason why we target agents is because the human element, the human interaction between a customer and their agent or the person who's selling them the insurance product is really critical,

[00:12:49] particularly in our regions here in Africa, because, you know, sometimes people don't really understand the true value of these products,

[00:12:56] what the impact is for them if they don't have it.

[00:13:00] So those conversations, I think, are the most important part.

[00:13:04] And you can only have that through the trust and the relationships that a lot of these agents build with their customers over time.

[00:13:10] And it also opens up the opportunity for them to sell them new products, maybe products that they haven't,

[00:13:15] that are not statutory required products, for example.

[00:13:20] It gives them that opportunity as well to explain to them the value of certain products.

[00:13:25] Because what we have seen is that sometimes, you know, a customer having a poor experience in terms of the timelines it takes to be insured may impact whether or not they want to buy another policy in the future as well.

[00:13:38] Fantastic.

[00:13:38] As part of your growth and impact, you've managed to raise a considerable amount of money, I believe it is $5.5 million,

[00:13:48] as one of the first female African founders in your space to do so.

[00:13:53] What were some of the lessons that you've gained from that experience?

[00:13:58] I would say that, you know, when we first started to fundraise, our first round was during COVID.

[00:14:03] COVID. So we were fundraising in 2020 in a time where I think a lot of investors also didn't know what it was like to, you know,

[00:14:12] they were very risk averse at that time.

[00:14:14] So when you throw in the fact that we're having a pandemic, plus we're also in the insurtech space,

[00:14:19] which a lot of investors don't really, they don't really understand or they're not very excited about because it's not like,

[00:14:26] you know, as exciting as maybe general fintech.

[00:14:29] You know, it was very interesting in terms of the processes that we faced.

[00:14:33] It took us many conversations to find investors that were actually interested in investing in our business,

[00:14:40] who understood the potential of what insurtech can do for the insurance ecosystem in Africa.

[00:14:47] So I would say that some of the main learnings for me were that, you know,

[00:14:52] you have to try and find investors that maybe have invested in similar businesses outside of Africa,

[00:14:57] who understand the landscape because, you know, it's more difficult to convince a traditional fintech investor to invest in an insurtech business

[00:15:06] than one that has done that in the past, you know.

[00:15:08] So that was one of the main learnings.

[00:15:10] And, you know, our lead investor at the time found us through an online conference that I was speaking at.

[00:15:19] So it was a very random encounter.

[00:15:21] So I would say that, you know, there's also some luck in it.

[00:15:26] But it has been very interesting.

[00:15:29] And even that entire diligence process through during the pandemic was, you know,

[00:15:34] took so long because nobody knew how to manage diligent process remotely.

[00:15:40] So it was it was a big learning experience.

[00:15:42] But when we came to our second funding round, it was a lot faster, a lot more streamlined,

[00:15:47] because I think investors were used to doing, you know, remote processes.

[00:15:52] So it was it was definitely a lot better, a lot faster.

[00:15:56] And what we're seeing now is that a lot of investors are really focused on your profitability.

[00:16:03] How long is it going to take you to get to that point?

[00:16:06] What are your revenues, your net revenues?

[00:16:08] So the conversations are very different than what they were three years ago, for example.

[00:16:14] Interesting.

[00:16:15] I was actually going to ask in terms of since then, the fundraising space has considerably changed on the continent.

[00:16:23] What would you say the space looks like at the moment for African startups specifically in your space?

[00:16:30] I think it's very difficult to fundraise in this moment at this time.

[00:16:36] Because a lot of investors are quite skeptical about businesses in terms of their sustainability,

[00:16:43] how longevity of businesses, how capital efficient are they as well.

[00:16:48] So it's a very different situation to be in.

[00:16:51] And I think that for the first time in a few years, the investors have all the power now compared to before,

[00:16:57] where at least for a couple of years, you know, founders and business owners were more in control of the kind of terms that they're getting.

[00:17:05] So I would say that there's definitely been a large overcorrection, in my opinion, of how the ecosystem is working at the moment.

[00:17:14] But I think it also has a positive effect on us as founders because you sort of think about, you know,

[00:17:22] the longevity of your business in more detail.

[00:17:24] So you're really thinking about the cost, you're really thinking about the unit economics,

[00:17:28] which just means that you build a better business, which I think has been really, for us,

[00:17:33] it has been a really great, great thing, you know, to focus on these areas and ensure that you can actually hit profitability really fast.

[00:17:42] I agree. I agree. I guess with insure tech still being a relatively new concept for many on the continent,

[00:17:52] how do you go about educating potential investors about its value or potential?

[00:17:59] I think it's definitely not easy because you can imagine that we're trying to convince them of two things.

[00:18:08] The first thing is that the 2.2% that's penetrated in the market, for example, is actually big.

[00:18:19] But you're also convincing them that there's potential to take on the remainder of the market that hasn't been tapped yet.

[00:18:26] So I think that, you know, explaining to investors, I think most investors can see the opportunity

[00:18:31] because it's still 98% untapped market in insurance.

[00:18:35] But the questions that you get is really how are you going to effectively tackle that large portion of the underserved market?

[00:18:43] So I would say that for us, we try to do a lot of research, but there's also a lot of estimates that go into it.

[00:18:49] In terms of, you know, you have to find a way to sort of find that TAM that you're trying to address

[00:18:54] to showcase the opportunity at hand, which, you know, at the end of the day, it may not be very accurate,

[00:19:02] but it is an indication of, you know, the size of the market.

[00:19:06] So if we look away from the direction of the customer,

[00:19:10] how do you go about educating customers about the value of insurance?

[00:19:15] So what we do for the agents, for them that are interacting with end customers,

[00:19:19] is we run a lot of training programs at our offices.

[00:19:22] So we have training twice a month for different products that are available on the platform.

[00:19:29] We explain to them the processes, the, you know, the potential value of those products for end customers,

[00:19:36] sort of trying to teach them how they can also sell those products to customers and explain to them

[00:19:40] the different, you know, nuances in those insurance products,

[00:19:46] because of course insurance products are quite complicated.

[00:19:49] So we try to do that for the agents twice a month.

[00:19:52] And then from there, we hope that they'll be able to actually access new customers with that information.

[00:19:58] So they'll be able to maybe upsell or cross sell to existing customers

[00:20:01] or target additional customer segments that they were not tackling before

[00:20:05] because they didn't have the knowledge of those products, for example.

[00:20:08] So I guess the lack of awareness is a challenge.

[00:20:10] So how have you gone about managing the challenges and potential risks of working in a emerging market,

[00:20:18] I guess with a sector that is maturing, but it's still in its early stages?

[00:20:24] I think it's really for us, we try to focus on the experience.

[00:20:27] So not only the onboarding experience for the customer, but also, for example, if a customer has a claim,

[00:20:32] how will an agent manage that claims process through our platform for their customer

[00:20:37] to make sure that it's paid quickly and it's, you know, paid fairly as well,

[00:20:43] that it hasn't been declined for various reasons.

[00:20:46] So we do try to make sure that that journey is also automated through our platform.

[00:20:50] And I think that's how you build the trust.

[00:20:52] So if a customer is receiving a policy in under two minutes, you know,

[00:20:57] I interviewed an agent a couple of weeks ago who told me that the reason why they love using our platform

[00:21:01] is because their customer thinks that they're a superhero if they can give them a policy in two minutes,

[00:21:06] you know, something that they never had before.

[00:21:08] But then for us, it's also about the process of in case there is a claim.

[00:21:13] How is that process done?

[00:21:15] Most of our claims are processed in less than seven days.

[00:21:18] And industry averages 60 days for claims to be processed and paid.

[00:21:22] So we try to make sure that the experience is not only at the point of purchase,

[00:21:27] but also to build that confidence in us and in the agent through the claims journey as well.

[00:21:34] You mentioned that you focus on the experience.

[00:21:37] So what's been the general feedback from customers, I guess,

[00:21:40] especially some of the SMEs that you insure?

[00:21:45] I would say that the feedback is generally quite positive.

[00:21:48] I think that a lot of whether it's SMEs that we were insuring in the past

[00:21:53] or agents that are using our platform to target customers,

[00:21:57] I'd say the main positive feedback that we receive is that it saves them time

[00:22:03] and it saves them money to use our platform.

[00:22:05] And I think for us, that's really exciting to hear

[00:22:08] because, you know, a lot of these agents were spending a lot of their money

[00:22:13] to, you know, visit different insurance companies, get different quotations,

[00:22:17] manually do all of these various things that, you know,

[00:22:20] meant that they were spending so much time and effort.

[00:22:23] And now they are able to sell policies at the comfort of their home, you know?

[00:22:28] So we do see that, you know, it's having a positive impact.

[00:22:32] We also noticed that there's a lot of female agents on our platform.

[00:22:36] And I think that's because of the flexibility that it offers for them.

[00:22:40] So they're able to sell products at any time, any place.

[00:22:43] They're not really time bound by, you know, the general day-to-day working hours,

[00:22:48] more traditional working hours.

[00:22:49] So they have that flexibility, which means that they're able to, you know,

[00:22:54] work within their own time and still have a, you know, an income that they can rely on.

[00:22:59] You know, another great story that we had is for one of our super agents on our platform.

[00:23:04] So she joined us a few months ago.

[00:23:08] I think it was in February of this year.

[00:23:10] And at that time she was generating policies.

[00:23:13] She was doing policies of about $7,000.

[00:23:15] And by August, her policies had increased to $58,000.

[00:23:19] Wow.

[00:23:20] So we were able to help her grow her income significantly.

[00:23:23] She actually bought her first car.

[00:23:25] And she, you know, she's been saying that she's so glad to be using our platform

[00:23:30] because it's really simplified the process for her.

[00:23:32] She had, she's in control of her work.

[00:23:35] And she, it's really transformed her business for her, you know?

[00:23:39] So it's things like this, the impact like this that, you know, keeps us going and makes us

[00:23:44] continue to work on creating this experience, the best possible experience that we can.

[00:23:50] Technology plays a huge part in the customer experience and what you do in terms of making

[00:23:57] insurance more accessible.

[00:23:59] Do you have any future plans or advancements in terms of the technology or the way it operates,

[00:24:07] the functionality, the services that it will provide or offer to customers?

[00:24:12] Yeah, we have a very long roadmap of different features onto the platform.

[00:24:16] I think, you know, some of the main ones that we want to do is further advance the claims journey

[00:24:23] so that it's even more efficient than what we have at the moment.

[00:24:27] I think there's a lot of use cases there for, you know, various types of technology like AI

[00:24:32] to simplify the claims journey.

[00:24:35] And then also just in terms of the processes that we have on the platform.

[00:24:41] So streamlining those further, you know, things like renewals,

[00:24:45] although all of that is automated through our platform, we want to add all the capabilities

[00:24:49] on all product lines.

[00:24:50] So we're still adding more product lines onto the platform so that an agent doesn't have to

[00:24:54] go to a different, doesn't have to do anything manually anymore.

[00:24:57] So they can purchase all products through the same platform and manage that.

[00:25:02] So there's a lot of different things that we're working on.

[00:25:04] And I think also there's a lot of capability, there's a lot of capabilities you want to build

[00:25:08] around data.

[00:25:08] So we're collecting quite a lot of information on processes, on, you know, different kinds of products,

[00:25:16] the success of products.

[00:25:17] So that can also help insurance companies, you know, become more profitable when it comes

[00:25:22] to certain product lines.

[00:25:23] So we hope that we'll be able to introduce those kinds of capabilities so that we can also

[00:25:27] have a positive impact on the entire ecosystem as well.

[00:25:31] Amazing.

[00:25:31] You highlighted further advancing the claims journey.

[00:25:36] I was wondering, typically, what type of claims do your customers make?

[00:25:40] So most of the time, majority of our policies are actually motor related products.

[00:25:46] So most of the claims that we get are, for example, like accidental damage to a car or like

[00:25:51] windscreen damage.

[00:25:53] And those are pretty straightforward and easy to process.

[00:25:56] So what we require from the customer is essentially a police report of the incident and then just

[00:26:02] some photos of the accident, which can be done on the platform.

[00:26:06] And then we process that claim to the insurance company.

[00:26:10] Some of the things that help us in the journey, streamline the journey is because we have integrated

[00:26:17] more stringent KYC processes.

[00:26:19] So actually our claims rate is much lower than what you'd see in the industry already, because

[00:26:24] we're just ensuring better risk in comparison to what others in the market are ensuring

[00:26:29] due to the KYC that we do.

[00:26:31] So we have seen that, you know, those are the main claims that we have, but they're usually

[00:26:36] processed in about seven days and paid out to the customer.

[00:26:39] You mentioned that your claims rate is much lower than the industry standard.

[00:26:45] How many claims would you say you've paid in 2024?

[00:26:50] So maybe just to, so far I can explain from between January and September, we processed

[00:26:59] about $2 million in premiums and we paid about $60,000 in claims.

[00:27:04] So the rate is, I think, less than 5% of claims paid.

[00:27:09] The loss ratio for the insurance company, the industry average for these kinds of products

[00:27:13] is actually closer to 70%.

[00:27:15] So we're well below the industry average.

[00:27:19] And I really think it's because of the KYC processing that we do, because we're able

[00:27:23] to sieve out a lot of, you know, if somebody is not adhering to the KYC process, basically

[00:27:28] they cannot buy the policy from us.

[00:27:30] So it means that you limit sort of bad risk being onboarded onto the platform.

[00:27:35] With the claims that you've paid out, what impact would you say this has had on customers,

[00:27:40] the people, the communities that you serve?

[00:27:43] Yeah, I would say that it has, you know, at the end of the day, as a customer, when you

[00:27:47] buy a policy, you only, you're buying, you're paying for it just so that your claims can

[00:27:52] be paid in case of an accident, right?

[00:27:54] So for example, anyone who has a business that relies on their vehicles, whether that's an

[00:28:01] Uber driver, motorcycle rider, you know, moving companies, for example, for them, it's

[00:28:07] really transformative.

[00:28:08] If you're able to pay their claim and they can have their car fixed and be back to work

[00:28:13] in less than a week, you know, for them, it makes a huge difference in terms of their

[00:28:18] earning potential.

[00:28:19] So we have seen that for those kinds of industries in particular, you know, they're more excited.

[00:28:26] I guess they're the most excited that everything works so seamlessly.

[00:28:30] It's clear that you're taking a very innovative and forward thinking approach to insurance on

[00:28:38] the continent.

[00:28:39] In terms of where you operate, what you do, are there any new trends that you're seeing

[00:28:44] in the insurance, insured tech space on the continent that you're quite excited about?

[00:28:50] Definitely.

[00:28:51] I think some of the exciting things that we're seeing is really the use of AI, whether it's

[00:28:57] for claims processing or other parts of the journey, the insurance journey.

[00:29:01] And I think that's going to have a huge impact because at the end of the day, somebody purchasing

[00:29:06] insurance products, the fact that their claim is being paid, it's being paid on time means

[00:29:10] the most to them.

[00:29:11] You know, that's what builds the trust and builds the confidence in actually purchasing

[00:29:16] insurance in the future.

[00:29:18] So I think that these kinds of technology and use cases of this kinds of technology will

[00:29:22] have a really positive impact on the insurance penetration rate over time.

[00:29:28] So if we move from current trends and look at the future, where do you see Africa, Nigeria,

[00:29:34] Kenya, wherever it might be, whichever market you choose, where do you see those markets in

[00:29:39] say five years time in terms of the accessibility of insurance for the general population?

[00:29:46] I think that we'll see a big change already in the last five years.

[00:29:51] I can say that the market has transformed enormously already.

[00:29:55] And I would say that, you know, more access to products, simplified journeys, more flexible

[00:30:01] product offerings as well, I think is what we're going to continue to see.

[00:30:06] And I think there's also going to be a change, hopefully, in the perception of insurance.

[00:30:10] You know, people are going to understand the benefits in more detail, which means that they're

[00:30:16] actually more inclined to purchase it.

[00:30:18] So there's going to be a lot more education and understanding of the benefits of insurance,

[00:30:23] hopefully.

[00:30:24] And I'd like to say that we'll hopefully see that the insurance penetration level does

[00:30:28] change a little bit, especially with the growth of retail products.

[00:30:33] So historically in Africa, a lot of the insurance that's being sold is mostly corporate policies

[00:30:39] for large businesses and such.

[00:30:42] So I think that now, due to the use of technology, we're going to see a lot more retail products.

[00:30:47] So, you know, normal people are going to be, you know, purchasing insurance products because

[00:30:52] it's available and it's easy to purchase.

[00:30:55] So I'm hoping that that's what we're going to see.

[00:30:57] We've already seen a big change already in terms of just...

[00:31:00] When we launched our first product in January 2020, we were the first ever digital car insurance

[00:31:04] experience in sub-Saharan Africa.

[00:31:07] So already now you're seeing a lot more insurtechs.

[00:31:10] You're seeing a lot more businesses that want to tackle the insurance space.

[00:31:14] So I would say that hopefully we'll see a big change in the offerings that are available

[00:31:18] in the market.

[00:31:20] Fantastic.

[00:31:21] So if we look closer to home, where do you see yourself and Lamy in five years' time?

[00:31:25] I know you have a target to break the 3% insurance penetration barrier in Africa.

[00:31:31] How close do you think you'll be to that target in five years' time?

[00:31:35] I hope we'll be a lot closer than we are now.

[00:31:37] I think we're currently, we're doing about 16,000 policies per month in the business.

[00:31:45] So, you know, our objective is to ensure more people, you know, across more markets.

[00:31:51] So right now we're only in Kenya.

[00:31:52] So the goal would be to implement this agent platform across various markets across Africa

[00:32:00] and, you know, transform the journey for these intermediaries in the market.

[00:32:06] Yeah, I think for us it's just to ensure as many people as possible and to continue to

[00:32:11] build trust towards insurance products across Africa.

[00:32:15] Brilliant.

[00:32:15] And I look forward to seeing that happen.

[00:32:18] Quote of the week.

[00:32:19] As people, we often have quotes, mantras, African proverbs, affirmations that keep us

[00:32:24] going when times are challenging or when times are good.

[00:32:28] Do you have one that you can share with us today?

[00:32:32] Yeah, I think for me, what I always try to remind myself is that don't forget that you're

[00:32:38] in your race.

[00:32:39] Like, you know, sometimes it's very easy to get distracted, to look around, to look behind

[00:32:44] you, to try and see what others might be doing in the space.

[00:32:47] But I think that has always been something that I try to always remind myself is to continue

[00:32:53] on the journey and continue to run the race that we're on.

[00:32:57] And I think that has helped us to, you know, remain in the game, remain innovative as well

[00:33:03] in how we perceive the market and also to not get distracted.

[00:33:06] So just, you know, be very focused on the objectives that we have at hand.

[00:33:12] Thank you for sharing that.

[00:33:14] We've come to the end of today's conversation.

[00:33:17] A fantastic conversation, Jihan.

[00:33:19] Thank you for sharing your incredible journey.

[00:33:22] It's great to see the work that you're doing in terms of making insurance accessible for

[00:33:27] those who need it most.

[00:33:29] And can't wait to see what the future holds for you and your team.

[00:33:33] It's been an absolute pleasure having you on the podcast.

[00:33:36] Thank you so much for having me.

[00:33:38] Thank you.

[00:33:39] Thank you to everyone who has listened and stayed tuned to the podcast.

[00:33:43] If you've enjoyed this episode, please subscribe, share or tell a friend about it.

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[00:33:54] Thank you and see you next week for the Unlocking Africa podcast.